<div dir="ltr"><br><div class="gmail_extra"><br><div class="gmail_quote">On 7 November 2014 22:42, Poke, Michael C <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:poke.michael.c@edumail.vic.gov.au" target="_blank">poke.michael.c@edumail.vic.gov.au</a>></span> wrote:</div><div class="gmail_quote"><br></div><div class="gmail_quote"><snip><br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left-width:1px;border-left-color:rgb(204,204,204);border-left-style:solid;padding-left:1ex">
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<p dir="ltr">But my one main issue is with this 1NF question. My simplest response to this question is "why?". </p></div></div></blockquote><div>I wondered the same, since the result is obviously inadequate to make the table at all useful</div><div> </div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left-width:1px;border-left-color:rgb(204,204,204);border-left-style:solid;padding-left:1ex"><div><div><p dir="ltr">Isn't normalising to 1NF unnecessary
and bad practice? </p></div></div></blockquote><div>Only if you stop there and don't go on to 3NF (Reminds me of the Holy Hand Grenade in The Life of Brian...)</div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left-width:1px;border-left-color:rgb(204,204,204);border-left-style:solid;padding-left:1ex"><div><div><p dir="ltr">Isn't it ideal to design databases to be 3NF compliant in the first instance? Why bother with this step? Is the purpose of this question to merely see if students instance what 1NF is? </p></div></div></blockquote><div><br></div><div>I suspect it is. It seems they were trying to ease off normalisation for this year at least. </div><div>But to normalise that horrible table to only 1NF is completely pointless and artificial without going on to 2NF...</div><div>Like asking art students to paint a face without eyes.</div><div><br></div><div>Without 2NF and more tables, the mixing of interestgroups data and contactlist data in a single record is ridiculous, and I can't see a reasonable solution that would make the data useful. Expanding a <b>single</b> field (like interestgroups) into 3 new records would let the kids show they understand 1NF, but why add <i>another</i> similar field to just make it awfully messy and difficult, for no greater demonstration of 1NF knowledge?</div><div> </div><div>I can't work out whether the examiners were looking for this...</div><div><br></div><div><img src="cid:ii_i29p59ld0_149921300ccdf0c1" width="556" height="150"><br><br></div><div>or - as Gary has suggested - 15 records, repeating each interest group 3 times to add the contactlist data. And that's a LOT of writing for 3 marks.</div><div><br></div><div>Whichever way you choose, the result is an ugly, unusable mess.</div><div>The question should have limited itself to <b>one</b> repeating field and left the other one well out of it.</div><div><br></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left-width:1px;border-left-color:rgb(204,204,204);border-left-style:solid;padding-left:1ex"><div><div><p dir="ltr">At least it was only 3 marks and not 6 or 8 like other
years. </p></div></div></blockquote><div> </div><div>Yes, that was a relief.</div><div>The fact that it was only worth 3 marks - and the space provided for the answer was only a third of a page - suggests to me that they were expecting the shorter answer I showed above. But that's a guess.</div><div><br></div><div>*I* would not have written 15 lines for 3 marks, I can tell you!</div><div><br></div><div><br></div><div><br></div></div>-- <br><div><div dir="ltr"><div><div dir="ltr"><div><br></div><div>Mark Kelly</div><div>mark AT vceit DOT com</div><div><a href="http://vceit.com" target="_blank">http://vceit.com</a></div><div><br></div><div><i>I love the sound of people's voices after they stop talking.</i></div><div><br></div><div><div>I, Mark Kelly, am entirely responsible for the offensive verbiage I spew forth.</div><div>Have I offended anyone with this post? I would not be surprised.</div><div>If offended, please whinge to me at the email address above. </div><div>Please leave poor Kevork alone. It is not his fault.</div></div></div></div></div></div>
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